If you use Garritan sounds, there is a Bass Trombone that goes down there during playback (I have checked it). If you have a trombone section, give the Bass trombone a separate midi channel.

Michel, first of all, thank you so much. I usually set up my playback using Garritan Jazz Sax, Trumpet and Trombone one through three and use the Orch. Bass Trombone Solo; as. there is no jazz bass trombone in the included Garritan sounds.

For some reason, I overlooked getting me playback trombones set-up, correctly in Score Mgr. I switched my 1-3 trombones to jazz trombones and changed my 4th trombone to Orch. Bass Trb. Solo and it works! I am getting all of the written low notes, played.

Great & thanks!

Hey, to a brother bass bone player. If you want the best sound you can using Finale get NotePerformer3. The trombone is one of the most difficult instruments to reproduce digitality. The trombone has so many overtones and, BTW, the slide to deal with. Unique to the instrument. The bass trombone only increases these issues. If I use the default Finale sounds I set the bass bone part to playback tuba at least it gets all the notes.

But NP3 does pretty good and your best option.

Denver, I’ve faced similar issues of range with some strings and was usually able to edit the sound files to enable higher or lower notes than what Garritan limits them to. I can’t remember all the details, but it isn’t hard and a search on the web will undoubtedly find the methodology. That said, I agree with Ernest about NotePerformer. It does work quite well for brass (and less so for strings in some ways). 

NP3 does pretty good and your best option

I had tried it, admittedly a long time ago, and wasn't impressed. However, ready to give it another shot, but before I even bother with the trial download, some questions. I see that there apparently is still a second delay during playback - how irritating do you feel that is?  Is one supposed to use HP (which I actually never use with Garritan PO) with it, or not at all? I don't use Finale to make demos, only basically use it to check notes and get some general idea of orchestration, but it might be nice to find something somewhat better than what I am doing now. Working much with voices at the moment (individual and choral) - how does NP3 specifically compare there with GPO? And some more (ignorant) questions - does it work with Ctrl-spacebar playback? Can several instances of NP be loaded into different banks in order to have more volume control over groups of instruments? When switching between several open Finale files, does NP have to reload each time? If so, does it take a long time? Any other comments? Thanks ...

I use NP3 quite often and for audio files. There is no longer any significant delay. And yes you can load several instances. I’ve also used it combined with GPO5 since NP has different strengths and weaknesses when it comes to strings. GPO5 handles glissandI; NP3 doesn’t handle it well and that is listed as a problem on their web site. Yes one has to invoke HP. 

"I see that there apparently is still a second delay during playback - how irritating do you feel that is?"

I disagree with David. There is still a delay and a prolonged hangover.  Yes both are irritating but as I understand they are necessary for NP3 to work. It apparently reads the entire file each time you call it. The solution is to use the standard Finale sounds while composing then change to NP3 when you are done or almost done and just need some minor edits.

That is why I select tuba for bass trombone when composing or arranging a chart.

Maybe it’s my computer. Maybe it’s just me, but I don’t find any noticeable delay or at least nothing annoying. I do know that it has to scan first to apply its AI but it seems to be so quick that I don’t notice it. 

Those of you running NP3, I just downloaded the free, trial version, last evening. Do you have to make the NP3 settings on every Finale file that you open? I made the NP3 settings on one Finale arrangement and it worked, fine. Just to see what happens, I opened another arrangement in Finale, and it still showed Garritan playback when I looked at its score manager. Maybe I need to go over the NP3 user-instructions, once more.

Thanks for the nice discussion my original question generated.

Thanks! Typically it works without additional tweaks once you’ve set it up but old files will default to their soundbanks. Make sure you’ve dragged NP above all other options in the sound map priority. 

The solution is to use the standard Finale sounds while composing then change to NP3 when you are done or almost done and just need some minor edits.

That's pretty much what I have been doing for years, except at the end I go to a DAW for final audio versions (and still using the GPO instrument sounds, which are really quite good in general).

"Do you have to make the NP3 settings on every Finale file that you open?"

Yes.

"Make sure you’ve dragged NP above all other options in the sound map priority."

Personally I would not and I don't do that. You can and it will make NP3 the default soundfont. However, you will see the delay and over run of sounds or latency as NP3 calls it.

Garritan is another area where MM has failed to improve upon it at all. Started out a good thing. A very good thing comparing it to what Finale had before. And, for composing it is still the best way to go. When you are composing/arranger be the composer. When you are through you can become the sound engineer and tweak all the NP3 settings to your like. Best of both!

Well Ernest, I guess we're going to have to agree to disagree on which to use as the default. Different strokes for different folks.

I very much agree with you that Garritan has not improved at all. I still rely on GPO5 but have moved more and more to NP, including for routine work except where i know NP will not be good at all (eg, works with glissandi, certain strings since the sound is not always what I want, etc). Overall though, GPO5 and NP3 coexist well. This string quartet uses both GPO5 and NP3; NP3 works much much better for string harmonics whereas GPO5 works better in some cases for the overall sound> 

" I go to a DAW for final audio versions ..."

I tried that a while back but it was just too time consuming. Trouble.  Perhaps if I knew more about using a DAW it would help. But it is so simple to apply NP3 to the finished Finale file and do some minor tweaks right there inside Finale. My best practice right now is, I make two files. One score and one sound. Of course I do that upon being finished with the score version.

I must say Perfect Layout and Note Performer 3 have spoiled me. And, saddened me too. It is what Finale could be!

David I listened to your piece. I am sorry but that style of music is way out of my wheelhouse so I am unable to say if the sound  is good or not. I am not even sure what the instrumentation is. I am sure it was a lot of work for that kudos to you.

Everybody has to set Finale up the way it works best for them. That is one, perhaps the one, beauty of Finale. It is almost endless the way you can use it or what you can do with it. That's why, to me anyway, it is the best music software in the world.

I make two files. One score and one sound .... upon being finished... 



I do that too (as well as a third one for parts, but that's another story again ...), and going to a DAW is indeed time consuming to set up - might still/again give NP3 a try.

"... might still/again give NP3 a try."

Yup, NP3 is just another tool in the tool box. Best to use the right tool at the right time.

My best practice right now is, I make two files. One score and one sound. Of course I do that upon being finished with the score version.

I must say Perfect Layout and Note Performer 3 have spoiled me. And, saddened me too. It is what Finale could be!

I do the same. Much safer to have two files, but I only do that when I really need to.

TBH, neither one has spoiled me; they still require a good deal of work (and PL is less necessary for the music I've written in the past two decades, since there are at most 1-2 markings and often no collisions, but very critical when I went back to older scores that were more complex; there PL was very helpful).

I am sorry but that style of music is way out of my wheelhouse so I am unable to say if the sound  is good or not. I am not even sure what the instrumentation is. I am sure it was a lot of work for that kudos to you.

No apologies necessary; it's an acquired taste and my family hasn't even acquired it. It's for string quartet as mentioned. Some sounds use GPO5, some NP3. Good way to combine both and use each for their strengths, which are complementary in my opinion.

Thanks for all the input. If you will bear with me just a little longer .... If I install NP3 and, as instructed, change the soundmap priority to it, that is not document- but system-specific. When I open any of my existing files which are set up with GPO5 in various banks, using the ARIA-multi player, will they continue to play back as usual? It seems to me they would, unless I Reassign Playback Sounds, at which point  NP3 would take over the setup. Correct? If I want to use other banks still with the Aria player and GPO, for some sounds, is that just done in the score manager by assigning a bank and then in VST Banks & Effects choosing ARIA? If I don't want to make NP3 the priority, can I still use it only in certain banks/instances? One more (you may not know this, since you're loving and using it ...) - if I don't find it useful, will it un-install with out any problems? (sometimes bits of un-installed software keep hanging on ...) Just wondering.

Everything you assumed is indeed correct. I can’t comment on uninstalling since I’ve not done that but I’d think it would be straightforward. 

"... I install NP3 and, as instructed, change the soundmap priority to it, ..."

I would encourage you to install NP3 and NOT make it the priority ... at first anyway. You can change that at anytime. Of course there is no right and wrong way to use Finale if what you are doing works for you. Still it makes more, or at least some, sense to use the sound as is for composing and afterwards make a sound file that you tweak. In the sound file you can do all sorts of things that have nothing to do with composing. There won't be any lag or latency caused by NP3 for instance. NP3 uses Finale scripts to set up the various sounds. These have to be read each time it is called. Doesn't matter if it is a note or an entire playback.

As to how it uninstalls, I have no clue as I would not and have not even considered not using NP3. It is that much better!  It's simply mind boggling how much better Finale could be from the box with seemingly little effort on MM's end. With their knowledge and expertise these expanded features, Perfect Layout and Note Performer 3, could be incorporated in Finale.

Even my Sibelius friends use NP3. Sibelius' default sounds are no better than Finale's. Not bad, just not great.

Ernest, every major notation software product (Finale, Sibelius and yes, even Dorico) do not provide the most capable or comprehensive sound libraries as their default offering; their focus is on notation first, playback second. It's not their bailiwick. As a result, many Sibelius and Dorico users are in the same boat as we are; we purchase additional sound libraries (which is why I eventually sucked it up and got GPO5 on discount, which has never been enhanced since i purchased it many years ago) and finally NP. Note that NP is not a sound library but an AI-based playback system, so it's a bit different in that regard from GPO5 and similar things. 

Even though I am 100% sure I write the most amazing, kickass minimalist music out there, believe it or not, I don't have tons of performers knocking at my door begging to perform my wonderful and visionary music. Guess what-all of us composers with rare exceptions are in the same boat. We think we write great music, and many of us probably do, but that doesn't mean we can get it performed. If I'm lucky, I get a performance every year or two, usually in Europe and usually by one or more brave musicians who just happened upon my music online (that's how I had a percussion work premiered in France last year, and a work for four violins recorded on YouTube by a great Japanese violinist who was stuck in Tokyo under lockdown for Covid-19). Anyway, the reality is that most of us are very much dependent on playback for generating decent realizations of our music because no one else is going to perform it, for the most part. So I'm glad that things like GPO5 and NP exist and that I've gotten them to provide what I think are pretty good "performances" of my music. Same is true of Reason, which I have used for their sounds and also for improvisation/composition (which then gets transcribed note-by-note, painfully, into Finale).

Yes, I wish all this stuff was included in Finale. But again, this is not how it seems to work in general for notation programs. I've never used Sibelius or Dorico but I hear much the same thing on various forums about their sample libraries; much of the chatter these days regarding NP seems to be from Dorico users. 

Everyone is in a different boat so to speak. We are all different and have different needs. I do get my music played. Not as often as I would like of course and I do make some money with it. Not enough to live on mind you but I can buy a Happy Meal once in a while.

Playback is as important as is print layout. Potential purchasers and music directors like to see and hear what they are buying or playing before hand. Nothing is more important than the other or the entire package if it is what you need. At this point Finale as is falls short and doesn't fulfil that requirement but it does an outstanding job with the PL and NP3 add-on plug-ins. And sad to say that complete package could be so much better if MM got on board.